- Starting off, a huge lesson on the power of authenticity that Ryan experienced with his clients when he decided to grow out his beard, seems silly, but huge lesson here.
- Next we talk about the difference between being an “advisor” and being a “coach” and how that can make an impact on your clients staying the course with the plan you’ve laid out
- From there we get into an incredible discussion on how advisors out there on radio can translate this to a podcast and where this technology is going and why it pays to be an early adopter.
- Then we dive deep on the framework Ryan used to create a thriving community in his private FB group and how if he was doing it for financial services, what it would look like and how he’d go about doing it.
Already heard it once or twice? Please leave a short review here, and tell me which guests I should have on!
- Listen to it on iTunes.
- [04:36] The story behind Ryan’s EPIC beard and some valuable lessons for financial advisors about authenticity and setting yourself apart.
- [08:33] Ryan shares his incredible journey, from his time serving in Iraq to working in the financial services industry, to starting a podcast and building a successful online business.
- [13:51] Why every financial advisor needs to learn how to become a great marketer! Ryan shares best practices for surrounding yourself with great people and tapping into their invaluable knowledge.
- [19:06] How financial advisors can use technology to their advantage and connect on a much deeper level with clients.
- [28:35] How to completely resonate with any audience by focusing in on a specific niche.
- [35:57] Learn to have real-world conversations that excites and engages your clients!
- [38:25] The collaborative client approach that helps your clients fully understand financial decisions and defend them to others!
- [42:22] Discover the incredible benefits to podcasting and why most financial advisors are missing out on a massive opportunity!
- [50:35] The power of community and Ryan’s methodology for turning a passive audience into a die-hard following that keeps coming back.
- [57:15] The step-by-step process Ryan follows to to siphon his audience from consuming his content, to subscribing as a member, to buying his products and services.
- [01:04:42] Find out what you can do to build an insanely interactive Facebook community. Don’t miss Ryan’s advice for how to handle haters, what to do if your high paying clients disrespect the ground rules, and why every financial advisor should incorporate a private Facebook group into their offering.
- [01:20:55] Still paying for prospect lunches trying to land new business? Find out why Ryan believes you’re doing it all wrong!
- [01:25:34] Why Ryan thinks of himself when he hears the word “successful.” Trust me, his answer won’t disappoint.
- [01:26:46] The importance of rendering yourself obsolete from your children and teaching them how to be leaders in all aspects of life.
- [01:28:17] What is Ryan’s favorite book and why?
- [01:31:15] Ryan shares the one piece of advice that has led to his success.
SELECTED LINKS FROM THE EPISODE
- Connect with Ryan Michler
- Order of Man
- Order of Man Podcast
- Order of Man Annual Battle Planner
- A Man Thinketh
- Endurance: Shackleton’s Incredible Voyage
- Spartan Race
- The Revenant
- Grit: The Power of Passion and Perseverance
PEOPLE MENTIONED IN THE EPISODE
REVIEW OF THE WEEK
This week we’re going to feature 2 recent reviews, the first one comes from Brooke Craven who says:
I appreciate the kind words Brooke, thanks for listening! One of the things I hear constantly in many of the reviews and feedback from our Blueprint listeners is you love the guests I have on, so I’ll keep doing my best to deliver there, stay tuned for upcoming shows with one of the top RIAs in the country who manages over a Billion dollars of assets and also one of the foremost wine experts in the world where we’ll dig into how to host a proper wine party and talk intelligently about wine when ordering for guests, excited for these shows!
Our next review comes from Andy Storch, he says,
So that’s it for this week’s show and for those out there who haven’t given a review yet, I’d love if you’d take a quick second to do so at bradleyjohnson.com/itunes and if you have future guests we need to have on the show, make sure to include them in your comments as we read all of them! Thanks for listening this week and we’ll catch you on the next show!
TRANSCRIPTClick here to Read the Transcript
[00:00:38] Brad: In this episode, I talk with Ryan Michler. He’s a financial advisor just like you but he also happens to run a top 50 business podcast with over 250,000 downloads a month called the Order of Man. From his podcast tribe-like audience, over 33,000 members have joined his Order of Man private Facebook group which is a thriving online community. And lastly, Ryan’s a veteran who served our country in Iraq. So, with all of that going on, Ryan has also somehow had the time to grow the most amazing beard to ever graced our podcast so be sure to hop out to the show notes to see our video interview if you’d like to see his beard in action.
So, here are just a few of the highlights from our conversation. Starting off, a huge lesson on the power of authenticity that Ryan experienced with his clients when he decided to grow out his beard, seemed silly, huge lesson here. Next, we talk about the difference between an advisor and being a coach and how that can make an impact on your client staying the course with the plan you’ve laid out. From there, we get into the incredible discussion on how advisors out there on radio can translate this to a podcast and where this technology is going and why it pays to be an early adopter. Then we dive deep on the framework Ryan used to create a thriving community in his private Facebook group and how if he was doing it for financial services, what it would like and how he goes about doing it.
A quick note for you financial advisors out there as we talk about some ideas here that are very cutting edge on the podcasting, Facebook and social media front to attract and retain clients. So, as a reminder, this constitutes advertising and depending on your licensing could be treated very, very differently. So, please, before you decide to adopt any of these strategies recommended today, please ensure you understand the compliance requirements and limitations and if you’re an investment advisor representative, be sure you have prior approval from your RIA. That’s it. Great ideas from Ryan here. Just make sure you’re safe from a compliance standpoint before you run with them.
[00:02:37] Brad: So, let’s get to the conversation. All of the show notes are available at BradleyJohnson.com/25. As always, links to books mentioned, people discussed as well as a complete transcript of the show are available there as well and be sure to stick around after the show as this week I’ll cover two recent reviews from Blueprint listeners. Thanks to all of you who have just been showing the love out on iTunes. It’s incredibly appreciated. And as always, thanks for listening and without further delay, my conversation with Ryan Michler.
[00:03:10] Brad: Welcome, everyone, to this week’s episode of the Elite Advisor Blueprint podcast. I have my buddy, Ryan Michler, from the Order of Man here with us today. Welcome, Ryan, to the show.
[00:03:19] Ryan: Brad, what’s going on, man. Glad to be joining after what our – it’s been a couple of months hasn’t it or longer? Shorter? I don’t know. Time goes so quick. Who knows. It all blends together.
[00:03:26] Brad: You throw kids and business in the mix and it’s just a time warp from there.
[00:03:29] Ryan: It’s true. Yeah, it’s true.
[00:03:31] Brad: So, yeah, it’s fun because you’re I think the only guy that, well, I know for a fact the only guy I’ve ever had on a podcast where I can say we met while learning to throw hatchets.
[00:03:39] Ryan: This is true. Yeah. That makes it extremely, extremely unique, right? What’s the best way to form a friendship though? Over throwing hatchets.
[00:03:46] Brad: As long as it’s done safely, you’re all good. It’s a bond forever.
[00:03:50] Ryan: That’s right. That’s right.
[00:03:51] Brad: Yeah. We were down in Austin, a cool resort, Travaasa, for those of you listeners if you want to check out a very manly resort. We were doing a dad’s retreat with our mutual friend, Jon Vroman. So, what better way to lead into a podcast with the founder of The Order of Man?
[00:04:06] Ryan: Yeah. I think it makes perfect sense and I can’t say that I’ve done that with anybody else either so this is perfect.
[00:04:11] Brad: Well, let’s dig in because there are so many questions I want to ask you. You have just such an intriguing journey. What little I know about you, I’ve got such a high level of respect. You’re a dad to four children, you’re an Iraqi combat veteran and you’re a financial advisor which is great because this show is for financial advisors.
[00:04:29] Ryan: Makes sense. Yep.
[00:04:30] Brad: And then you’re a podcaster. You basically started this incredible movement and I want to dig into that. So, as we kick off here today, I got to get this out of the way because if I’m a listener and I don’t know who Ryan Michler is, I’m going to watching this on the show, I’m going to be like, “What is up with that amazing beard?”
[00:04:51] Ryan: That’s true.
[00:04:52] Brad: And so, rather than have everybody think it the whole way through, we might as well just get it out.
[00:04:56] Ryan: Just to dress it up front. Yeah.
[00:04:57] Brad: Right. And we’ll get to some really fun conversation. So, how did the beard come about? What’s going on there?
[00:05:03] Ryan: No, this is really interesting. I always have the sexy stubble. You know what I’m talking about, right? That sexy stubble. So, I had that going on for a little while and it actually bothered my wife. It irritated my wife and so she said, “You can either shave or you can grow your beard out.” I said, “Perfect. I’ll grow my beard out,” and that’s what I did. I did that about two-and-a-half years ago and I haven’t looked back since. So, I trim it up. It’s about a year’s length right here but I’ve been growing it for about two-and-a-half years now. It was actually really a difficult decision because I was in my financial planning practice, 100% of the time, when I started growing it. And so, I thought, “Oh, my clients, they’re not going to like this. They’re going to leave. They’re going to think I’m unprofessional.” It’s really fascinating, if anything, it’s actually help build a connection with my clients more than anything. It’s really strange and I’m just as busy as I’ve ever been I thought more so with financial planning practice and referrals and everything else I get. It’s kind of crazy.
I actually bought a domain name, TheBeardedAdvisor.com, and I haven’t used it and I probably never will but I thought, “Man, I got to secure that and wrap that up,” and so I did. You got to own it, man.
[00:06:07] Brad: You know what I love about that? There’s a lesson there in financial services because you’ve been to these financial services conferences before.
[00:06:13] Ryan: Sure.
[00:06:14] Brad: Everybody’s in a suit, the tie.
[00:06:16] Ryan: Yes.
[00:06:16] Brad: Clean shaven.
[00:06:17] Ryan: Yes.
[00:06:18] Brad: You completely just broke that thing completely out of its mold and it’s working for you.
[00:06:23] Ryan: Right. And it does. You know, it just sets you apart. Obviously, you have to be professional and you have to care about your clients and you have to know your stuff and you have to have all that other stuff that we talk about but if you can find a way to differentiate yourself in a positive way, man, it really set yourself apart. And so, the beard, as crazy as it might seem, actually works really well from a marketing perspective because it’s very memorable and so it actually worked out in a way that I didn’t think it’d work out.
[00:06:47] Brad: What’s the lesson in authenticity there? I mean, did you have some clients just be like, “Dude, I’m glad you’re yourself?”
[00:06:53] Ryan: Yeah.
[00:06:53] Brad: What was coolest comment that you got?
[00:06:55] Ryan: That’s the deal. I have one client in particular, in fact, they live a couple of blocks away from me and what was really funny is she flat-out said, “I do not like your beard but I’m glad that you have it.” And so, every time she sees me she just shakes her head. She’s like, “I don’t like your beard,” and I’m like I don’t care. And it’s just really funny this banter that we have but the lesson in authenticity is confidence. And so, this is me. I like having a beard. I feel comfortable in a beard. It’s just part of me literally and figuratively I guess. And when you find your groove whether that’s your facial hair or the way that you dress or your mannerisms or whatever it may be and you start to develop that groove, you build this level of confidence that’s hard to articulate. And when you have that level of confidence, that exudes and clients recognize that. And although she may not like my beard, she knows that I’m confident with who I am and that translates perfectly over into me giving her financial advice and credibility that I have with her.
So, anytime you can do something that’s going to build your confidence, and I’ve got a friend of mine who is also a financial advisor and he is a cowboy. I mean he is a Southern Utah redneck cowboy so he wears jeans, he wears his wranglers, he wears his belt buckle, he wears a cowboy hat, he’s got his boots on and he goes into all of his meetings like that because that’s who he is. And I think in a financial industry what I’ve seen more than anything else, probably any other industry, this could be financial advisor, attorney CPAs, we’re so like concerned about impressing people and, yes, we want to put our best foot forward but we’re so concerned about impressing people that we end up being very inauthentic and fake and phony in a way and clients recognize that and see right through that.
[00:08:33] Brad: Well, give us a little bit of your journey because I worked with financial advisors for a decade. I’ve never seen a journey like yours. It’s a really incredible one.
[00:08:41] Ryan: Yeah.
[00:08:41] Brad: You got into financial services and then let’s go down the path of podcasting and the massive Facebook following that started to build and then probably growing at this minute. Can you just give us the high-level version of that so everybody kind of catch up to where you’re at?
[00:08:54] Ryan: Yeah. You bet. So, I started in a financial industry about a decade ago right in 2008 when the market was collapsing and I didn’t know. I didn’t know any better so I got in the industry. I was actually in retail before that and I took – I went to Iraq. I served in the military and my wife and I decided we didn’t want to get back into retail when I got back for some reasons that we can talk about in another conversation but I came back from a leave and I had met with a financial advisor because we had saved a lot of money. I didn’t have to pay any taxes. She was living with her mom and her dad while I was overseas and so we saved a lot of money. I’m like I don’t know what to do with this money. So, we met a financial advisor while he was looking for two junior advisors at the time so I actually took all of my study materials, my insurance and my investment exam requirements and licensing stuff back to Iraq. And in my downtime, I studied for those tests, came back, took the exams and I’ve been doing that ever since.
So, that was a really – it was a blessing to be able to do that and have some downtime and to be able to fall into it that way. It ended up being a very good journey for me as far as building my confidence and understanding how money works and psychology which has been huge for me with my journey now with Order of Man. I worked with a couple of different firms and then I want to say roughly three years, four years ago I started my own RA and I always felt out of place. I always felt awkward. I always felt like within a financial planning practice there had to be more than this traditional model of meeting clients and developing and building relationships. And I’ve been listening to podcasts like this one and other ones. I’ve just been listening to these podcasts and I’m like, “Man, there’s probably a way that I can use this to tap into my financial knowledge and share that with a broad audience.” And so, I started a podcast called Wealth Anatomy and the goal with that podcast was to provide financial advice and services, not even services, just advice in general to healthcare professionals because I’ve been doing a lot of work with dentists and some dental schools across the nation.
[00:10:47] Ryan: So, I launched this podcast with the help of a mutual friend, Jeff Rose, who also him and I are in a very similar path. He helped me. I hired him. In fact, I was one of his very first paying clients I think from a consultant standpoint. He walked me through the process and I did about 20 episodes with Wealth Anatomy and I really found that I had a – I just love this podcasting medium and it was so amazing that I can talk with these people that, frankly, I didn’t feel like I had any business talking with but because I had this platform, it was exciting. But on the other side and what I know a lot of guys and gals are listening to this podcast right now would be interested in is I remember I had a pediatrician from I want to say it was from Pennsylvania give me a call randomly, just random call, and he says, “Hey, I need some disability insurance.” I said, “Okay. Tell me a little bit about yourself. Tell me what you’re looking for,” and he listed like I need this, this, this, this, this, this and this and he was very articulate on what he wanted with his disability insurance.
And I’m like, “Man, you know exactly what you want. You’ve obviously researched this.” He’s like, “I haven’t done any research.” I’m like, “How do you even know all these terms? Like you’re talking about terms that it’s like industry jargon and stuff like that.” He’s like, “Well I listened to your podcast last week,” and that particular podcast happen to be about disability insurance. And before I’m like nobody in their right mind, no medical profession, no intelligent high income earning physician is going to call this guy, this bearded weird dude who they don’t even know and they’ve never met and yet here was this pediatrician calling to purchase disability insurance from me and basically, and I know this is not always the case but the reality of the situation is I just had to take an order and I am done. Like, it was pretty incredible. And so, it really opened my eyes to the possibilities of putting information out there and delivering it as widely as possible and letting those come to you who are interested to be able to come to you.
[00:12:35] Ryan: So, to shorten this up and tie this up, I really realized I love the medium of podcasting. I just didn’t want to talk just about financial advice. I wanted to broaden the perspective. And being a man is obviously something I’m interested in. I’ve got a young family and at the time my wife and I were married for ten years or so and so you get to that ten-year run and I’m like, “Man, how do I be the best father? How do I be the best husband? How do I be good in a community? How do I be a better business owner?” And so, I really went to work with this new project, Order of Man, which is dedicated to helping men become better leaders in their families and their businesses, their communities and just better well-rounded man altogether. So, that’s like a very shortened version of how this whole thing went down. It’s crazy.
[00:13:18] Brad: What’s cool about that is there’s about three questions I want to ask you right now.
[00:13:21] Ryan: All right, man. Fire away. Yeah. I should’ve paused and given you that opportunity.
[00:13:24] Brad: No. You’re good, man. I want to keep it out there. So, I think the first lesson is you saw something you are interested in that you knew absolutely nothing about.
[00:13:34] Ryan: Yeah.
[00:13:35] Brad: At the time, podcasting, and you hit up Jeff Rose. So, I’m curious, number one, Jeff is a mutual friend, really good dude. Also, a financial advisor that’s grown a massive platform. What was it that you made you reach out to Jeff? Did you randomly Google him and find him? Did you have a mutual acquaintance? How did you, guys, cross paths?
[00:13:52] Ryan: So, marketing has always been something that’s been on the forefront of my mind. At the end of the day, I think every financial advisor needs to learn how to be a great marketer. Because truth be told, we all have access to the same products, we all have access to the same platforms and strategies and systems and some of us are fee-only and some are fee-based and some are commissioned. I mean, you name it, right, but we all have access to the same stuff. So, at the end of the day, the financial advisor that learns how to market themselves the best is the one that wins, market those services and package those services and the advice that they’re sharing in the most effective way that the consumer resonates with the best. And so, I have learned all about the products and the strategies and that was great but now I’m like, “Okay. How do I get this stuff in front of people?” And so, I went to FinCon which is financial bloggers conference. Have you been to that before?
[00:14:47] Brad: I haven’t.
[00:14:47] Ryan: Really – yeah. You ought to check it out because it’s a great conference. I went out there and met some great people and in the process of going out there, I had been doing some research and one of the sites that I came across was his site, Good Financial Cents. And I started following this guy who, yes, was a financial advisor but he didn’t look like a financial advisor. You know that traditional financial advisor, the mold that a lot of us tend to fall into at times. He didn’t speak like a financial advisor and yet here he was putting himself out there and getting what I interpreted to be great advice for people. And so, I followed him and followed him and followed him and, man, I want to do what he’s doing. So, I sent him a message or sent him a couple of emails and I think we corresponded back and forth and this was the first time I ever hired a coach or a consultant to help me with this stuff. And I think I was, like I said, his first client and he said, “Yeah. I get so many requests that I have to charge you for it.” I’m like, “That’s fine. Whatever we need to do, let’s make it work.” And so, I took a leap of faith with him and it ended up panning out to very well. That’s what launched Wealth Anatomy and that’s what morphed now into Order of Man.
So, I think the lesson there to tie this all in together with what you’re asking is find people that are doing it, find people that are doing it better than you and surround yourself with them. When I was starting in a financial planning practice, I really floundered. I struggled. I was making my $30,000 a year for a couple of years and I was almost at this point where like I’m going to throw in the towel. I can’t feed my family. I can’t make this work. I don’t know what to do. And before I did, I just looked up for a second and I saw that there were two or three advisors in my office who were killing it like consistently. Every single week, every single month they were just killing it on numbers and so I just reached out to them and I said, “Hey, can I take you to lunch?” And the answer with these guys was, “Yes, of course. You can take me to lunch,” and I started asking them questions and figuring out how they did it.
[00:16:34] Ryan: I brought them on my casework. I included them in with my clients and that was the launch of when I really saw this that my financial planning practice start to take off rather than just flatline which is where it was before. So, ask for help. I mean, there’s a lot of people out there have great knowledge, go out there and get it. You wouldn’t be listening to this podcast if you weren’t interested to that anyways.
[00:16:53] Brad: Yeah. Well, I mean, this is all advice that we’ve all heard. Jim Rohn, you are the average of the five that you surround yourself with.
[00:16:58] Ryan: Exactly.
[00:16:59] Brad: But I think what’s cool about that, there was a humbleness from your side. It was I don’t have the answer and I’m humble enough to reach out and ask someone whether it’s to lunch or whether it’s hitting up Jeff Rose.
[00:17:11] Ryan: Yeah.
[00:17:12] Brad: Well, I mean, you’ve just been following his blog and I have an interest in how this guy’s marketing his business and what he’s doing and then cutting the check to actually make it happen. I guess the follow-through is there as well. So, lots of lessons in that. Okay. So, just right before we went live here, I looked and this is going to spiral into a really fun conversation.
[00:17:31] Ryan: Okay. Now you got me. Yeah. You piqued my curiosity.
[00:17:33] Brad: I’m getting hyped up here, right.
[00:17:35] Ryan: All right.
[00:17:36] Brad: So, 28,968 members in your closed Facebook group as of this morning just before we went live here, Order of Man closed Facebook group.
[00:17:47] Ryan: Yeah.
[00:17:48] Brad: And that’s incredible. What’s crazy about you as a financial advisor, to me, what I just find super intriguing is, yes, you’re a financial advisor. It’s kind of like this is maybe a horrible analogy but I’m going to throw it out there anyway. I feel like you’re Clark Kent during the day and you’re Superman, you like bust out of a cape and you’re over here podcasting and run a massive following over here.
[00:18:10] Ryan: That’s fun.
[00:18:11] Brad: So, with that being said, I feel like financial services in general is so far behind from a technology standpoint whether it’s doing a conversation like we’re doing on Zoom right now, whether it’s old-school terrestrial radio that they’re paying $3,000, $4,000, $5,000 a month for an hour a week where you’re producing a podcast right there out of your home I would assume.
[00:18:35] Ryan: Yeah. I’m in my guest room in my basement.
[00:18:38] Brad: So, I’m giving a really long lead up but I want to just kind of really dive deep here because there are so many opportunities with how you started marketing, I mean, that story of having somebody halfway across the country reach out to you randomly you’ve never met before from a podcast. So, if I’m a financial advisor and I’m sitting here and I have my old school traditional marketing which is public seminars, terrestrial radio, maybe some client referral events, can you maybe share some secrets to what you’ve uncovered from podcasting which then led into closed Facebook groups which I know now you’re working on some really cool live events you’re promoting as well. So, can you walk us down the steps of the roadmap to maybe some keys there that financial advisors could maybe benefit from just from the path that you’ve taken?
[00:19:28] Ryan: Yeah. You bet. So, this is a good conversation and this is where a lot of advisors I think might tune out or maybe even take offense to what I’m going to say but it’s definitely going to challenge the traditional mold and there might be even advisors who have been in the practice for 20, 30, 40 years who might be listening to the show and what I’m about to tell them they’re going to say, “No, no, it can’t be that way. It can’t be that way.” I’m here to tell you it is and if these advisors who have been in the business for two, three, four decades don’t learn how to adapt, they might as well just retire right now because they’re done, and that’s the reality of the situation.
And the reality is, is that if we as advisors approach our work like robots then we don’t have anything to offer because I can go get any financial information I want on Google for free and there’s going to be a lot of advisors that are going to say, “Well, it won’t be good and it won’t be this and it won’t be that.” That’s outdated thinking. Guys, like I can get every single bit of information that I could get from you that you charge, I can get for free. I promise you. And if you can’t wrap your head around that, you’re dead like you’re dead in the water and your practice is going to stagnate. I mean, this is the reality of it. And so, I think a lot of financial advisors will look at technology as an evil thing like technology is the enemy. It’s not the enemy. It’s this awesome platform to connect to even deeper with your clients. And that sounds counterintuitive because you’re thinking how can technology, something that’s not face-to-face connect you with clients? Well, Brad, tell me where you live.
[00:20:54] Brad: Right in the heart of Kansas.
[00:20:55] Ryan: Okay. So, you’re in Kansas. That’s right. We talked about it. You’re in Kansas. If we didn’t have this medium, we wouldn’t connect, right? I mean we met through a live event but that all came through digital technology that was used that connected us. So, that’s first and foremost. The other side of this is for a young advisor who might be listening to this show right now consider just for a second that you’re learning from guys who had been in the business for 40 years and everything that they’re teaching you and everything that they’re training you and everything that they’re telling you to do and all the conversations that they’re telling you and everything else is the same strategies that they used 40 years ago, 30 years ago. Even 10 years ago it was so different.
And what I’m here to tell you is that if you learn from only those trainers, you’re not going to learn this new way of marketing that younger and younger people and even retirees, baby boomers, when you look at baby boomers and their activity level in Facebook, for example, is if I understand correctly they are the highest growing demographic within Facebook and you’re telling me that these retirees aren’t interested in technology? That statistic proves otherwise. So, I think it’s very important that we find these new mediums to be able to reach more and more people especially since we can get this advice for free.
The third component of this is don’t be boring. Like, don’t be boring. I mean when you start getting in the numbers and advisory fees and annuities and insurance and mutual funds and all of these things that we go through, people don’t want to hear that like that’s not engaging, that’s not exciting and as much as you might think it is as an advisor, you’re wrong, it’s not. It’s not fun and it’s not exciting and people require and to a degree demand some level of entertainment because otherwise there’s no use having you around which brings you to another component like you are a personality.
[00:22:55] Ryan: So, if you approach this again as a robot or a very structured or very rigid in your process, again, I can get that anywhere. That’s a dime a dozen. That’s cheap. But what I can’t get is I can’t get a relationship. I can’t get the personality. I can’t get the individual attention. I can’t get the level of engagement and trust through a computer that I can with you. So, find a way to like really connect. One of the things that was really fascinating to me is as I started down this journey of new marketing with my advisory practice is I’ve started friending my clients on Facebook and a lot of people told me, “Oh no, no, no. Don’t friend your clients like it’s a business slash – you don’t mix business and personal, right?” And so, I’m like, “Well let’s try it. What’s the worse it can happen?”
And so, I would see my clients going to their kids and their grandkids’ games. I’d see the vacations that they were going. I see the hobbies they were interested in and so I could connect with them and I started commenting on their posts like, “Hey, have a great time in Hawaii,” or, “Hey, how was your trip? What was the most exciting thing? How did your son do in baseball? How did your grandkid do at soccer last season?” or whatever. And it just created this connection that I think advisors and clients don’t have because somebody told us that we need to put a wall up between us and the client. I don’t want a wall like I want to be deeply connected with my clients and I want to know them above and beyond just their money situation. So, I mean, that’s a lot like I can just rattle on and on and on why this is so important but at the end of the day like if we don’t find new ways to connect and new ways to market, we’re going to get slaughtered by the robo advisors and everything else that we feel like is the enemy of the financial services industry.
[00:24:31] Brad: Yeah. You made me think when you were going into the technology front there. We just had Darren Hardy speak at our event in January.
[00:24:38] Ryan: Very cool.
[00:24:39] Brad: And really respect there and he was talking on 21st century leadership and his first piece of that was technology and the fact that technology up to this point if you really look at human civilization, 1700s, well you had 800 years of advance, hundreds and hundreds of years of advance. There was a study that showed that this century due to technology will have 20,000 years of advance in 100 years.
[00:25:05] Ryan: Is that right? Yeah.
[00:25:06] Brad: Yes. Just because…
[00:25:07] Ryan: Isn’t it crazy?
[00:25:08] Brad: …exponential and then of course it was silicon chips. The computer was a full room. They cost $60 million. Now you’ve got hundred times the power of that in an iPhone and just some craziness there. But which made me think of is if you look at retail right now, it’s just getting crushed.
[00:25:25] Ryan: Yes.
[00:25:26] Brad: All of your retail stores. So, good move by the way to get out of retail.
[00:25:29] Ryan: Yes.
[00:25:30] Brad: Years back. You’re ahead of your time there but you saw it coming.
[00:25:34] Ryan: I don’t know if that’s the case or I just didn’t enjoy it as much as I once did.
[00:25:37] Brad: So, but Amazon is basically taken technology and made it easy for clients to consume whatever they need without going to a physical location for retail.
[00:25:46] Ryan: Right.
[00:25:47] Brad: And what’s interesting which I’ve never thought of before, financial advisors are old school retail at this point because everything is this brick-and-mortar building and it’s a very business transactional relationship and a lot of which you are just speaking to is go where your clients want you to go.
[00:26:05] Ryan: Right.
[00:26:06] Brad: They want you to be a real person. They want to have a real relationship with you. They want to be able to interact with you in an easy format to consume, not drive across town in horrible traffic to have to come to your office, right?
[00:26:19] Ryan: Right. And then think about, I mean, from a business management standpoint, think about the overhead that comes with that type of practice as well. It’s not bad. I think you just need to morph the two together. I told you I bought TheBeardedAdvisor.com. I also bought CyborgAdvisor.com and my thoughts was like you have this technology which is great but if it’s only technology, it’s missing a piece and then you have this personal approach which is great but if it’s missing a technology side, it’s not being as efficient as possible. And so, the mix is cyborg. So, I bought that site. So, I just go and buy domains when I have these ideas. I haven’t used either of them.
[00:26:57] Brad: I’m glad we both have this habit of just being one of GoDaddy’s best customers.
[00:27:01] Ryan: Exactly. Yeah.
[00:27:02] Brad: Buy random websites. You’ll probably never use them but just in case, right?
[00:27:05] Ryan: Yeah. That’s right.
[00:27:06] Brad: I’ve got a perfect logo for that website. It’s the Terminator 2 half Arnold Schwarzenegger face, half the metal you could rip that off and…
[00:27:14] Ryan: I have to put like a beard on Arnold Schwarzenegger’s face though if I were going to do that.
[00:27:18] Brad: I like it.
[00:27:18] Ryan: BeardedCyborgAdvisor.com. You just gave me a new idea.
[00:27:24] Brad: So, let’s dig deep here. I’m just so intrigued by when I look at the Order of Man and I’ve listened to the podcast, let’s speak to niching yourself first. So, let’s go there first and then we’ll just kind of go wherever the conversation goes but Order of Man to me really – you’ve got this tagline, protect, provide, preside.
[00:27:44] Ryan: Yeah.
[00:27:44] Brad: And then when you really listen to your show you have some amazing guests on, Jocko Willink, Extreme Ownership, former Navy seal. Who else have you had on?
[00:27:52] Ryan: Ted Nugent’s coming on next week.
[00:27:54] Brad: Ted Nugent? Nice.
[00:27:55] Ryan: Yes, sir.
[00:27:56] Brad: Ryan Holiday, one of my heroes.
[00:27:57] Ryan: Yeah. Ryan Holiday. Grant Cardone. I mean I’ve had some great guys come on the show.
[00:28:03] Brad: But when you listen to your show, it’s really about how to be a better leader, how to better lead yourself, self-improvement, discipline and yet you went Order of Man. So, if I’m a female, I can definitely benefit from your show.
[00:28:21] Ryan: Of course.
[00:28:21] Brad: I want to speak to niching though because you said, “I’m going to go here. I’m going to eliminate 50% of my potential audience,” just as easy to be easily to be a leadership podcast or great advice from top thought leaders, authors, all of that.
[00:28:34] Ryan: Sure.
[00:28:35] Brad: What made you decide I’m going to go heavy into this niche and I’m going to own it and I’m going to go hard in that direction?
[00:28:40] Ryan: So, I’ll talk about Order of Man in a minute. Let me go back to the financial planning practice because there’s a lesson there that I learned and that lesson was as I got about five, six years in the business, I realized that working – now I’m talking purely from a business management standpoint at this time. I realize if we want to connect with our clients, I get that. I understand that. Let’s just talk about the business like the practice management side of this thing. From a practice management standpoint, working with those that have high income and/or high assets, lots of wealth are the most profitable people to work with. Like, if I’m going to take an hour of my time, I want to work with somebody who has seven figures of income versus somebody who has maybe 50,000, 60,000 or even 100,000 of income. I mean that’s just how it works. So, I realized very quickly that the medical professionals were in that category, high income and high assets. And so, those were the most profitable people to work with. And as I started to narrow my path and started to work more even specifically with dentists, I realize that I was much more efficient in my practice that I got the lingo down, that’s big. That’s really important. I actually started to talk like a dentist.
And so, I would have clients that would say, “How do you know so much about dentistry? Like did you go to school or anything like that?” and the answer was, “No, I just worked with dentists. I know how you talk. I know how you communicate.” And so, I had somebody else say to me, “Ryan, it’s not really fair that you say you only work with medical professionals because the advice you’re giving just applies to everybody.” I said, “Yeah. That’s true but it’s completely fair because it’s the way that dentist in this particular case look at me and say, ‘Hey, this guy talks like us. He knows us. He knows our specific situation and we trust him and we have that trust, that level of trust and credibility in him because he works with our colleagues.’” Even though I could go work with an attorney for example that makes just as much, if not more, has just many assets if not more. It’s just having that niche is very, very powerful.
[00:30:34] Ryan: Now the downside of this from an outsider’s perspective is yes, you said it, you eliminate a percentage of your potential clients. That’s a faulty premise. What you’re assuming when you say that is that somehow, they were your pool or your client to begin with, and they weren’t. Like, they’re only your client when they become your client. And so, if I can choose who I get to work with, there are 7.3 or so billion people on the planet. I don’t need 7.3 billion clients. I need 300 clients depending on their assets or their net worth, their income or whatever it may be. And so, when we go out there and we assume that we want to connect with everybody, we connect and resonate with nobody. It’s the same thing when you ask for referrals and I know a lot of people listening to this ask for referrals. I do too. If I say, “Hey, is there anybody that you know that could use financial services?” What’s the answer to that? The answer is always, “Oh I don’t know,” or, “I don’t know anybody,” or, “Let me think.” But if I said, “Hey, do you have a friend who’s a dentist?” “Yeah. Bill down the street is a dentist.” “Hey, I work specifically with dentists. Do you mind making an introduction?” “Yeah. Sure. I can do that.” Now it gives me like laser focus. I’m hyper focused on this.
So, now to translate this into Order of Man, yeah, it’s leadership and yeah there’s a lot of principles that apply across genders but I can say something about leadership for example in a way that’s very masculine and that speaks to men that might frankly turn women off. That’s not my objective but they may not hear it or they may not resonate with it but that’s okay because if I share it in that manner and that man really resonates with it, he’s more likely to lash on to the idea and implement it and he’s more likely to share that idea as well with other men, not women, other men. So, now you’ve created this community, this in our case this brotherhood or fraternity of men who are speaking the same and talking the same and dealing with the same issues and approaching it from the same way and psychology is all working similar, not always the same but similar. It’s just powerful when you find that niche and you start to specialize.
[00:32:47] Brad: We were talking here before we went live and this speaks to the power of Internet and the power of your movement that you’ve created. I’m from Minneapolis, Kansas which nobody even knows exists on this planet unless you’re from Minneapolis, Kansas, a town of 2,000 people, right?
[00:33:00] Ryan: Right.
[00:33:00] Brad: And I had I think 50 people in my graduating high school class. One of my buddies just had a crazy good accomplishment, post it in your private Facebook group and makes the comment, “My high school classmates wouldn’t even believe I did this today and I’m like here I am literally reading it in your private Facebook group,” and just it speaks to the power of a really cool movement that you created and how it attracts the type of people that follow your thought process and kind of your movement that you’re creating.
[00:33:28] Ryan: Well, when you make it exciting and you make it different than what everybody else has already experienced whether it’s speaking to men about leadership and being well-rounded men or its financial advice and you do it in a way that is extremely unique that’s never been heard of or seen or experienced before, that’s when people start talking. Like, I’ve heard a lot of people say, “Oh our practice specializes in customer service.” It’s like, yeah. I mean who doesn’t? Like who wouldn’t say that? Or, “We really care about our clients.” Okay. Is there a financial advisor who would say they don’t care about their clients? Like this isn’t unique. You don’t sound unique. You don’t sound exciting. You don’t sound different. You might think you do and from your perspective you might feel like you do but from a client’s, in a consumer’s perspective you sound like everybody else and therefore you’re not share worthy. That’s the reality.
[00:34:22] Brad: Yeah. We speak a lot on the commoditization and we coach a lot of our clients on the commoditization of financial services. Like you said earlier, we all offer the same product.
[00:34:31] Ryan: Right.
[00:34:32] Brad: And when you also offer the same service, we do risk and fee analysis. We do retirement income planning. We do the same stuff you hear over and over, “Okay. Cool. Well, I’ll just go – so does my current guy so I guess I’m good.” And so, we speak a lot which you’ve done with Order of Man to packaging your process, differentiating your process. And you did it with your podcast movement. You did it also with your financial services practice. So, let’s go back a little bit to financial services.
[00:35:00] Ryan: Can I say one thing, Brad? Sorry to interrupt. Just before that, like you said something that just struck me. You said retirement income planning. And with all due respect, it’s like bleh. Like, number one, what does that even mean? Number two, that’s like some Prudential brochure that somebody would read in a doctor’s office or some – like it’s just not exciting like nobody’s going to read that and say, “Yes. I really need retirement income planning.” Like that’s not how people talk. Instead it’s like, “Hey, let me make sure that you have an awesome retirement. Let me make sure that you are able to go on all the vacations that you want to go on. Let me make sure that you don’t die before your money runs out or vice versa, that your money doesn’t run out before you die.” Like that’s how people really talk in conversations. So, I think we need to be very cautious of using those terms. Yes, it does describe and that’s how a dictionary might describe it but people aren’t dictionaries. Like let’s do it in a way that’s exciting and engaging.
[00:35:57] Brad: Financial services have this disease of industry jargon.
[00:36:00] Ryan: It does. It’s so bad.
[00:36:02] Brad: What’s interesting is we see it on our side. The guys that crush it that do extremely well what they’re masters of is taking complex terms and acronyms and breaking it down to real-world conversation. We have one of our advisors rather than talking about mutual fund fees, he talks about when he goes to the grocery store and he’s shopping. He always checks the price before you put everything in the grocery cart. Well, that’s what we help do is we’ll scan your cart when you come in and make sure you’re paying what you think you’re paying, right?
[00:36:30] Ryan: Right.
[00:36:31] Brad: And the guys that get it, that really break it down, and gals, I’m not eliminating them, they get it. They simplify the complex in our industry, the ones that end up doing really, really well.
[00:36:39] Ryan: Right. And isn’t this an ego thing too like our industry I think is notorious for these. Like think about an office, for example, and I might even call out somebody who’s listening to this. They walk into your office and it’s stuffy and it’s got all the fancy everything it needs and they come sit at this desk that’s further apart. And here’s the big one, your clients’ chairs are lower than your executive chair. Like if that doesn’t describe that I’m above you or that I’m more important than you, better than you, I don’t know what else does. I mean that’s how horrible it is. But what if you just, here’s what I did with my financial planning practice. This actually worked really good. I don’t have an office anymore but this worked really good. I created a living room in my office and so I had my office where I did my work and then I had another office room and I literally recreated my own living room in my office and I met clients. When I was sitting on a couch and they were sitting on a couch with a coffee table. I had a TV up here. It looked like a living room and the ability that we had to connect when we were hunched over the coffee table like drawing and writing and knee to knee was awesome. It’s powerful.
[00:37:46] Brad: Was that just a massive change in dynamic from when you are meeting across your…
[00:37:50] Ryan: Totally. Totally. I mean, just so much better connection like you said dynamic. People really got more involved because they didn’t feel like they were a kid at the principal’s office in trouble, hunched down in their chair like looking up to the principal. That’s crazy and that’s arrogance. It’s like I have to prove to you that I am adequate for your advice. It’s crazy to me and I think in this day and age it’s actually very damaging. It’s an old way of doing business and I don’t want to be talked down to. I want to be conversed with. I want to have a conversation and a connection with people.
[00:38:24] Brad: Yeah. A lot of our advisors call it co-creating a plan together because that’s really what a good financial advisor should help you do, right?
[00:38:31] Ryan: Right.
[00:38:32] Brad: It’s their money. It’s not yours. You have to remember that.
[00:38:34] Ryan: And even I like co-creating and even the term I’ve used a lot is coaching as well. And if you think about the role of a coach, the role of a coach is to extract. It’s to draw out. And so, you think of an advisor, an advisor is to put in. An advisor is to give advice. A coach is to extract. So, we’re not really helping people with financial advice because everybody knows financial advice like everybody knows the basics of how to save money. Everybody knows to buy low and sell high. Everybody knows all of these principles. There’s nobody you’re going to meet with that doesn’t understand some basics of finances 101. But what they have a hard time with is understanding and interpreting, their interpretations of it and also their emotions and how they respond to these little green pieces of paper that we call money. And so, a coach isn’t putting in, a coach is extracting so that a client at the end of the day can understand and really resonate with why they’re doing something in the first place.
Because here’s what I’ve had happen in the past is I would go out and I would tell my clients, “Here’s what you do, do X, Y and Z,” and they would go tell their neighbor Billy Bob or whoever and their neighbor would say, “Oh no, no, that’s stupid. Don’t do that. Do this. My financial advisor says this.” It’s like you’re constantly combating or putting your clients in a position to have to defend what they’re doing without knowing why they’re doing it. But if I go into a presentation, I sit down with my clients and I explain a little bit about what we’re doing and why we might be doing it but then extract and draw out why they feel confident in doing this, when they go talk to their neighbor and say, “Oh yeah, we’re doing this, this and this,” and their neighbor says, “Oh, it’s dumb.” They say, “Actually it’s not because this is why we as the client this is why we did this, not some guy who just told us what to do.”
[00:40:18] Brad: That’s great advice there. I mean that’s simple. I never thought about it that way but you’re right, an advisor puts in, a coach extracts. You made me think of a personal trainer.
[00:40:28] Ryan: For sure.
[00:40:29] Brad: If you think about it, everybody knows how to get in shape, eating less calories than you actually burn and then you should probably do some physical activity along the way too to bump up the calories burned.
[00:40:40] Ryan: Yeah. Get your heart rate going and lift heavy things.
[00:40:42] Brad: Right. But people still need personal trainers for the accountability aspect. And so, to me that’s also what financial advisors are is you’re the accountability coach to make sure you show up at the gym and they kind of tracks your progress along the way and make sure you don’t freak out the next time the market corrects and keep you on track. So…
[00:41:00] Ryan: Right. A good way that I heard it described was and somebody said this. He said and it’s kind of cheesy but it kind of makes sense. He says, how did it go, “I don’t coach people with money problems. I coach on money with people problems.” And it’s true because we get our own baggage and we come to this relationship with our own set of values and perspectives and how we are raised and what we’ve learned about money from people who are broke. And so, these are people problems when it comes to this little green piece of paper that has really no intrinsic value in and of itself except for what we place on it and so it’s us and our emotions and our baggage and our experiences and our culture and our background that get in the way and muddy the water sometimes.
[00:41:41] Brad: Yeah. I feel like every financial advisor would have been better served to be a psychology major.
[00:41:46] Ryan: For sure. Or a marriage counselor, right?
[00:41:47] Brad: Yes. All right, man. I’m not going to forgive myself if we don’t get to this so I want to make sure I want to go through kind of your methodology. So, I’ll set the stage and then you just take it from here. So, let’s look at your traditional financial advisor. Most of them, like you said, it comes down to marketing and those that market well typically has a two to three-pronged approach. They’re doing public events, seminars. They’re doing referral type of events, hosting fun events that their clients can come in and bring their friends to. And then the one that I think the highest an advisor that I see a lot doing are either radio or TV traditionally. What I really want to dive deep here is radio because radio is just another form out of a podcast.
[00:42:29] Ryan: It is. But here’s what I see.
[00:42:30] Brad: Here’s what I see with radio and then I want you to just unleash your thoughts on this because I know you’ll have no problem with it. Here’s how radio works in most financial services practices. I’m going to go out to the top station in my market. I’m probably going to have to pay $2,000, $3,000, $5,000 an hour if it’s a really big station and a really big market. I’m going to prep for my radio show probably an hour, an hour-and-a-half. What we’ve done for our clients is we actually co-host the shows, we help them with show notes, we produce.
[00:42:57] Ryan: That’s cool.
[00:42:57] Brad: So, that takes a lot of the work off the plate but here’s what actually happens. They deliver a great show, one hour and then it’s gone forever. They hope they get some calls and some appointments from that show, and then they do it again the next week and then the next week, then the next week. So, with that being said, I just did an interview with a guy named Pete Matthew, Meaningful Money, out of the UK. He’s just crushing it. And I asked him, “How many financial advisors do you know in the entire UK that have a podcast?” He said, “One hand, I think it was four, maybe five.” Ryan, it’s the same in the US. There’s like no financial – it’s basically you and Jeff Rose are carrying the flag, maybe a couple of other guys.
[00:43:33] Ryan: Not even me. I mean, I don’t do a financial planning podcast.
[00:43:36] Brad: Yeah. So…
[00:43:36] Ryan: It’s like Jeff Rose and that’s it. Maybe a couple of others.
[00:43:40] Brad: Yeah. So, let’s speak, let’s unpack first off why is that, and then second off, where are these guys missing the boat and what’s the potential out there that they could be actually reaping from just, if nothing else, just taking a radio show they’re already doing and then repurposing it as a podcast?
[00:43:56] Ryan: Yeah. So, to answer your first question, why is that, it’s fairly new. I mean it really is. Podcasting has been around for 10 years but it’s just starting to hit mainstream like if I – it’s funny because if I go to the gas station, for example, and I develop a relationship with somebody there and I had this happen just a couple of weeks ago. She said, “What is it that you do?” And I’m like I hate answering that question because it’s really hard to explain and so I’m like, “I help men be better leaders in their family, business and community.” It’s something like that. The elevator pitch, right? And so, she’s like, “Well, so like but how do you do that?” I’m like, “Ohh,” so like she finally extracted from me that I do a podcast and she’s like, “What’s a podcast?” Like, “What? What do you mean what’s a podcast?” That’s the truth. The reality is I was in South Carolina in a vacation with my family. So, the same thing and the gal is like, “What’s a podcast?” I’m like, “Pull out your iPhone,” and she pulled her iPhone out and I’m like, “See that little app right there?” “Yeah. I’ve always wondered what that is.” “Click on it and find me.” And so, she found, she subscribed to my show and everything else but it’s like just hitting mainstream and that’s why.
Radio has been around for, I don’t know, however long it’s been around but podcasting is relatively new. But it’s not that hard like it’s very simple. There are some tutorials and I can even give them to you if you want. You can put them on the show notes. We can talk about that later but there are some great tutorials on how to get a podcast started. The benefit of a podcast, let me just give you some numbers here. The benefit of a podcast is your global reach. At the end of the day, that’s exactly what it is. And the only people who are going to listen to your podcast are specifically seeking after your advice because if I jump on the radio and I’m listening to country, that’s what I listen to, if I’m listening to country and a financial advisor commercial comes on, I may or may not be interested in that. It may not be something that’s even in my wheelhouse or radar right now. But if I type in financial advice in the podcast search engine, I’m actively looking for financial advice. So, you’re already giving one barrier of entry and you’re only communicating with people who are seriously and genuinely interested in what you have to say. Otherwise, they just wouldn’t do it.
[00:45:52] Ryan: So, to give you a little perspective, our show Order of Man is not financial advice but Order of Man and I know there’s financial shows that are bigger than mine, Dave Ramsey for example. My show, my little humble show I started two years ago gets roughly 250,000 downloads per month. That means there’s 250,000 people that are listening to what I have to say for roughly eight hours a month, maybe a little less. Six to eight hours every single month they are tuned into me. I am in their earbuds. They are listening to what I have to say and they’re clinging and hanging on to every word. That’s powerful. And it’s nice because it’s on demand like I can access whenever I want. I can do it on a nude or I can do it on a workout or maybe I’m doing the dishes or maybe I’m mowing the lawn and I can access that anytime I want. But here’s the power. It’s evergreen. You go on our radio show and you pay $2,000, $3,000, $4,000, $5,000, whatever it may be. You do it once, done, and hopefully in that however many times you might air it or maybe it’s even a live episode, hopefully you get a client or two versus putting a podcast out there, it’s there forever. I mean, my podcast that were there two years ago I can continue to market that stuff. So, I market it and market it over and over and over. You just listened to the Jocko Willink show. I did that show probably over a year ago now. It’s probably close to or over a year ago and yet you just listened to it.
[00:47:14] Brad: Stands the test of time too, my friend.
00:47:16] Ryan: Exactly. So, there really is a great ability to connect and be in people’s earbuds and be in their brains and be at the top of their mind. They want that information and on the iPhone like what’s really interesting about this, this is relatively new. I think it came out last year. The podcast app on your iPhone you can’t even remove it. It just comes by default and it cannot be removed which tells me that the Apple is really staking a claim in the podcasting space, otherwise, they wouldn’t make that as a permanent feature of their offering on the iPhone. So, I think we’re just starting to see the uptrend of podcasting and I think this is a great time to jump on board with this especially when nobody’s doing it.
[00:47:57] Brad: Yeah. There’s a couple of things there too and I actually forgot one of my clients that actually does podcast, Jason out of Washington. He picked up his first millionaire client out of Kentucky.
[00:48:06] Ryan: That’s what I’m saying. It’s crazy.
[00:48:08] Brad: He’s in Washington. He never met the guy. He’s just tuning in, listening to his show. So, the other thing that it does is that radio show you’ve got a net over your market. So, you’re in Utah, nowhere in Utah. So, your radio stations wouldn’t be great but let’s say you’re in Salt Lake. If you had a radio show in Salt Lake you’d reach Salt Lake and that’s it.
[00:48:31] Ryan: That’s it.
[00:48:33] Brad: Podcast, you’ve got this distribution across the entire US and guess what it cost you? Essentially nothing.
[00:48:38] Ryan: Yeah. Well, it’s not just the US. It’s globally. That’s pretty amazing. You know, it’s really funny. I’m thinking now that we’re having this conversation, the way I even started this, you triggered this for me, is actually I created a CD. I’m like how can I leverage myself? And that’s the key like I only have 40 hours or so or whatever working hours, maybe it’s 60, maybe it’s 100. Whatever it is. You only have so many hours in a day. Like how can I leverage myself and my time and the information that I have? And so, I bought a bunch of blank CDs. I bought a microphone. This must have been three years ago. In fact, it’s right here. I still have the microphone.
So, I bought this thing from a financial planning practice. I’m like I’m going to record like a 5 to 7-minute just overview of what it is that I do. And so, I recorded this and I burned it on the CDs. I had a graphic designer make a CD cover for me and I stuffed these things. So, at night, me and my wife would stuff these blank CDs with the image in envelopes and I would give them to clients the very first time I met them except where I give them two. So, I’d give them one and then I’d give them another one and say, “Hey, if you find this valuable, will you just pass this one along to a neighbor, a friend or colleague, whatever it may be?” And that’s when I really began to wrap my head around how powerful audio can be and how you can use it to leverage your time and give yourself more time in a day.
[00:49:56] Brad: So, let’s continue this path of podcasting. Because this really intrigues me. This is something that I’m trying to work on too. So, you’ve got a podcast. You’ve built up this listenership. Consistency, you’re putting shows out every week so that’s really important. Great guests. But then what you’ve done, you’ve cracked this code of and this is – I’m going to bring this full circle because financial advisors, it’s great to put out a great radio show but if nobody’s calling in and setting appointments and actually want to come in and see you, well, guess what, you just have a really expensive fun hobby, right?
[00:50:28] Ryan: Right. And maybe not even that fun at times.
[00:50:31] Brad: Yeah. It might not be really a fun hobby. So, with your podcast I love the methodology because right at the front end, you say, “Hey, if you’re really liking this, come join…” and I forget your exact verbiage but basically, “Come join our closed Facebook group, the Order of Man, if you want to continue the conversation or be a part of the movement,” or whatever. Can you speak to where that came from? Was it just an experiment? Were there other guys like Jeff Rose that coached you and they’ve done this before? Because now what you’ve done you’ve taken them from passively interacting with you to actively. And you’re building some really cool live events which to a financial advisor that’s no different than a live seminar.
[00:51:11] Ryan: Yeah.
[00:51:11] Brad: Can you go through that? Because I think that’s an incredible methodology a lot of people can benefit from.
[00:51:16] Ryan: Yeah. So, I think a lot of times we underestimate the power of community and specifically in the financial advice like we isolate our clients, not deliberately, but it just happens like I have this client here and this client here and they don’t know each other. I don’t talk to them both unless we do some sort of a movie night or some sort of a seminar or something like that which is relatively common. So, I was thinking about with Order of Man like how can I grow a community? And that’s really when I started Order of Man. When I – even the title of it, Order of Man, society, brotherhood, fraternity. I want it to be a group of men where we could all come together and be stronger because we were communicating together and we were going through problems and solutions and we’re learning from one another. I think it can hold very true within the financial community as well. Like, let’s just say you had 300 clients for example or less, it doesn’t matter, and you have those 300 clients in a Facebook group and all of those clients were communicating like, “Oh I’ve got this problem,” or, “Hey, who do you use for an accountant? I’m dealing with this tax issue,” or, “Hey, my investments are down. What’s going on?”
And all of a sudden you have people who were literally working for you but not working for you. Like now they’re communicating and they’re talking back and forth what they like, what they don’t like. You get to listen in. Okay. What do they want more of? What do they appreciate? What don’t they appreciate? How can I get better through the feedback that I’m getting without even having to ask for feedback? The other cool thing that you do for lack of a better term is you create almost this vacuum or feeding frenzy of people who want your advice and services. So, when I launched our Facebook group I did it because I was listening to another podcast from a Facebook group specialist. He said everybody should have a Facebook group and I kind of him-haw around a little bit. I didn’t really introduce it immediately but I thought about it more and more and like, “Man, what could it hurt? I’m going to go ahead and give it a try,” and I gave it a try. And you’ve seen it. I mean it’s taken off and there’s so much great content and it requires a little bit more work on this end because we’ve grown as fast as we have but it’s worth it.
[00:53:14] Ryan: Now here’s what’s really cool. I’ve never, outside of my Facebook community or my emails, pay to promote one of my live events. We just got done with one. We have 30 guys flying from all over the nation and they pay a significant amount of money to be there and they all came from our Facebook group. I just made these journals available. This is a daily planner that I use and a lot of the guys were talking about what they’re daily and their morning rituals look like. Here I am sitting in the sideline looking and listening for what these guys want. They said, “I need some sort of plan or something.” So, I created this one in the Facebook group alone. I have not promoted this on the podcast. I have not promoted this even really through the – I haven’t promoted it through emails. I haven’t done any paid advertising for it. I’ve sold 600 of these through the group. Basically, I mean if I were to look, I probably made five posts over the past month or two about this journal and yet we’ve sold 600 and every time I get more in, boom, they go through. I’ve got five more sitting right there and I didn’t make a new order because it goes so quick. Same thing with hacks. I’ve got a bunch of hacks over there. This is my like office podcasting/storage/everything here in this room so I’ve got it all in here.
Anyway, you create this vacuum of people who believe in you, believe in the mission, believe in the cause, like your way of approaching whatever it is you’re talking about in this case, manliness, but it can also apply to financial advice and you’re able to connect and communicate with these people. And think about this, I can get on the phone with my one of 300 clients and I could take half an hour and go through some different things we’ve done, “Hey, here’s where your portfolio is. Here’s what’s going on in the market.” But what if instead of doing that, I can just put out an email post or do video even better. A video is like, “Hey, in the market here’s what’s going on, here’s how President Trump’s election is going to affect your portfolio,” and you take two to three minutes. Boom. Put it on a Facebook and now all 300 clients have that video. You didn’t have to make 300 phone calls. I’m not saying you should avoid calling your clients. You certainly should but this is how you leverage yourself and get more points of contact with clients and prospects.
[00:55:20] Brad: Yeah. What’s intriguing to me, Ryan, is like if you just think about business in general, what’s so challenging right now with such a fragmented attention span, like email was dead to me and what I mean by that is it’s not all the way dead but, man, even people that like and trust me that are my clients, it’s just so bogged down with minutia that if I want to have a very direct message and let’s say it’s, “Hey, here’s an idea that will double your business next year,” I could send that out, that subject line out, and it probably get 50% opens right now.
[00:55:50] Ryan: Yeah.
[00:55:50] Brad: Where Facebook that’s where the eyeballs are right now. If you see that little red circle in the top of your corner of your Facebook app, I’ve got an uncheck notification. Guess what people tap on?
[00:55:59] Ryan: Yeah. You got to clear those things.
[00:56:02] Brad: Exactly. And so, you’ve gone where people want to communicate and want to interact and my guess is if you post a video in your group, there’s a very high level of interaction with that at this point.
[00:56:15] Ryan: For sure. Yeah. I mean thousands of people are viewing those and seeing those. And if you do it in a way that’s engaging, for example, current events. So, you think about the election with President Trump, for example, that’s a hot subject. Whether you voted for Trump or you voted for somebody else, that’s a hot subject and anybody wants to hear about that at any given time. So, why not do a really short succinct video with your opinion? You don’t have to give a financial advice because there are some compliance issues with that but how political elections have affected financial markets in the past? And so, you talk about some of this stuff and do it in an engaging way and consistency because I see some guys will do this and they do a really good job and they do it for like a month and they give up. I’m like, “Why did you stop doing that?” “Oh, I wasn’t seeing results.” Of course. That’s like saying I’m going to go to the gym after sitting on a couch for 10 years and expect results in seven days. It’s like of course you didn’t see results. You’re building a foundation. Keep going. Keep doing it. It will work but you have to be consistent.
[00:57:15] Brad: So, can you walk through this high level and simplify this as much as possible? Here’s how I transition people from podcast listeners or for financial advisors that have a radio show because you could just as easily do this on a radio show. Here were the steps I took to siphon my audience from listening to going to Facebook actually knowing how to join my group. What was your steps there?
[00:57:36] Ryan: Yeah. Okay. That’s a good question. So, our largest reach is through the podcast so you said it right. So, let’s say somebody’s listening to the podcast for the very first time then they’re going to hear that message twice in the podcast that says join our Facebook group of over 29,000 guys having conversations about blah, blah, blah, blah. So, they’ll join the Facebook group. They had to request the access. At this point, we get about 125 to 160 or 170…
[00:57:57] Brad: So, real quick, because we’re breaking this all the way down. Are you saying go out to Facebook group or go out to Facebook and search for Order of Man?
[00:58:03] Ryan: No. I give them the link. So, go to Facebook.com/groups/OrderofMan. That’s the link and then they join that. So, like I said we had about 125 to 160 new members of that group per day now at this point. So, I mean it’s really starting to take off. From there, they’re going to get an intro video from me. So, I pinned an intro video at the top. Here is what this group is all about. Here’s what we do. Here’s what we don’t do. Here, if you want more, you may want to consider joining our exclusive mastermind. That mastermind is a paid mastermind. So, it’s more exclusive. It’s a lot more involvement from me. There’s worksheets and there’s other things that we go through and they pay on a monthly basis and so that’s where most of the revenue comes from the Order of Man at this point through that mastermind group. If I were doing it as a financial advisor, what I would do first and foremost is I would have that intro video and I would encourage people to join my email list. Now I know you said email is dead but I still think there is value to it. I know you do too. You just said it’s dying, right?
[00:59:06] Brad: It’s very noisy would be a better word.
[00:59:07] Ryan: It is. It’s crowded for sure.
[00:59:09] Brad: Yeah.
[00:59:10] Ryan: So, if it were me, what I would do is I would put together a quick resource like it and I’m just throwing stuff out here like a 10-point checklist to make sure your portfolio is in order or 10 questions every single person on this planet should ask their financial advisor or how to know if you’re getting screwed over in your fees and your portfolio. Something catchy, something clever but something pertinent and valuable. So, I would do that. And then from there now you can start emailing them with certain courses that you have, certain information that you have. One of the things that I actually did that worked really, really well is I put this three – no, let’s see. It’s a four-part course and I took it down because I don’t at this point do as much in the financial planning services and because I wasn’t updating it, there were some compliance issues that I was concerned with so I took the course down. But it was essentially when people signed up for it, they get one video from me and it was a video of me explaining the topic and I can’t remember the topic at this point. Three days later, another email in their inbox with a new video. Three days later another email with another video and then the fourth video is like, “Hey, here’s my calendar. Go set up an appointment with me.” So, now we’re walking these people from, “I just met you, I just heard you,” to, “Now you’re in front of me every three days. I like what you have to say. There are some real problems that I’m dealing with my portfolio for example and okay now you’re setting me up.” So, that fourth one is like, “Okay. Now I’m going to actually schedule something with Ryan,” and maybe that’s a half-an-hour quick phone call that you can see if we’re a fit. That’s the flow that I would personally use.
[01:00:47] Brad: Cool. Okay. So, a thought here. Actually, I think it will replicate what you’ve done with Order of Man so I think about, okay, a financial advisor has a radio show. Any random person in their market could be listening to that. So, would you set up a closed Facebook group for the public non-clients, I guess would be a better way to put it, and then would you basically have another group that’s just for clients where you offer more value, more interaction? What would that look like?
[01:01:15] Ryan: Yeah. That’s what I would do. So, if I were doing a radio show, let me just think through this a little bit here. If I were doing a radio show, my call to action would be, “Hey,” because look, here’s the deal. Like be real about, you gotta be real to yourself. Nobody’s going to hire you after hearing you on the radio one time. They’re going to need to hear over and over again and they’re probably going to need to hear your name from a friend and like, “Oh is that guy I heard on the radio?” “Yeah, that’s the guy.” “Okay. Maybe I should call him.” So, there’s a lot at play here. So, if you’re real with yourself, the reality would say, okay, since they’re not going to hire me on the first day, what would somebody do the very first time that they heard me? And if they liked me, one thing they would probably do is a very non threatening approach which is to go to, “Hey, if you guys go to ABCFinancial.com you’re going to find a resource that actually is a checklist on everything I just addressed in the show.”
That’s what I would do first and foremost. The reason you want to do that is because you’re going to capture more people that way because you’re not asking them to call and schedule an appointment. Nobody’s going to call and schedule an appointment. So, they go download this resource and you collect their email address. Now when they download the resource, you can set up what’s called an autoresponder. I don’t want to get like too in depth into this because we could go down the rabbit hole but an autoresponder is essentially an auto triggered email. When they sign up for your list, they get a default email from you, automated email. That email would say, “Hey, thanks for downloading XYZ. Here is your next step. Step number one, join our closed Facebook community where I give more information, more insight, more value above and beyond what you got in this resource and above and beyond what you heard in the radio show.”
[01:02:57] Ryan: Now when they go into the Facebook group, I would have an intro video that would say, “Hey, thanks for joining our Facebook community. Here’s what we do. Ask questions about financial stuff. If you have ideas or thoughts, please feel free to post those. I’m very active in here and you have to be active in the Facebook group. I’m very active in here. I’ll be sure to engage with what you have to say. In the meantime, if you are interested in scheduling an appointment with me for 30 minutes over the phone, here’s a link to my calendar.” Then I would do a daily video inside of that Facebook group. There’s probably people that are like, “Oh my gosh, like this is so much stuff,” right now. I’m just telling like marketing is the name of the game. I would do a daily video and that daily video would be on a topic that you actually charge for but you’re going to give some of that information away for free.
So, for example, if I have these journals available, the daily video I would do is how to set up the perfect morning and I would walk through the perfect morning with the guys that are listening in the Facebook group to that video and I’d say, “Hey, look, if you want to do this on your own, cool, get out a piece of paper each and every morning, write down what I just told you and get after it,” or, “If you’re interested in more just go to OrderofMan.com/whatever.” I don’t want to promote it at this point but, “Go and buy this. $35, you’ll have everything. There’s one in here for each day of the week, done, done, it’s all taken care for you.” And that is how I sell these but also provide value at the same time. This is a way for you to connect and resonate with your clients before your potential clients before they even hire you and decide if they like you. Like, they have to like you first. And they may not. And you may not like them too.
[01:04:41] Brad: Okay. So, we were chatting out in Austin and one of the things you said early on which I love how real you are. You’re just not like, “Yeah, this thing just took off.” You’re like, “No, honestly, when I first started my private Facebook group or my closed Facebook group I was the only one posting the questions and there were crickets chirping basically.”
[01:04:57] Ryan: For sure, yeah.
[01:04:58] Brad: So, did you do a video a day and then a couple of questions? What was your framework there to get the – because now I’ve been in there. I mean, you have a thriving community that’s interacting with each other and then you’re just chiming in from the sidelines. So, how did you prime the pump I guess would be my best question?
[01:05:13] Ryan: That’s a good – yeah. There’s even, and this is kind of, because there’s even people in the group at this point who I’ll say, “Hey, I’ve got 30 minutes. Just ask me any questions you have.” And there’s guys like, “Who are you?” “Like what do you mean who am I? I founded this group.” They don’t know because they come in through these other sources. Anyway, the way that I prime the pump, number one, consistency and so I committed to making three posts in my Facebook group per day and I know that sounds tedious, I know that sounds overwhelming but if I had my phone I would show you. On my phone, I have a notepad on my phone and it’s called group post and so if I’m driving down the highway and I see a billboard and it triggers a thought that I might want to have a conversation on, I’ll just jot that down there in those notes really quick. And I’ve literally got in that group post notebook at this point hundreds and hundreds of conversations or topics that I can discuss. So, if it’s new and I’m like, “Man, I need to make a post in Order of Man,” I just pull it up. “Oh, that’s a good one” and then I can make the post accordingly.
Or I’ll do a Facebook Live. A Facebook Live right now is really, really big. As opposed to doing video, recorded videos, do live video. That’s significantly greater engagement. Because Facebook wants people to be involved with Facebook Live so they promote it in the feed more heavily. So, that’s just a quick tip. So, yeah, the other side is ask questions but not what I refer to as dumb questions and believe it or not there are dumb questions like a dumb question would be, “Who here wants to get a better rate of return on their money?” No shit. Like, so obviously, like that’s a dumb question. Everybody wants to get a better rate of return on their investment. So, that’s not a great question. A better question would be how much do you pay for financial advice? Now it’s specific. It’s measurable and people can respond to that type of question. Or what rate of return did you get on your portfolio last year?
[01:07:05] Ryan: Now you have somebody that says, “Well I got a 4%,” and the next person says, “I got 8%.” Now the 4% is like, “Well how do I get 8%?” That’s an opportunity for you to chime in and say, “Hey, there’s a couple of different ways that might be happening within your portfolio that you probably ought to have somebody look at.” So, you’re asking questions and then you encourage other people to ask questions to get involved and the best way to do that is to let them know and then engage with them. It’s really interesting and this is going to sound funny but I’ve got a young puppy and I don’t want to liken training clients to training a dog. I don’t mean that at all but it’s a great analogy. I’ve got a young puppy here and even my children it’s about positive reinforcement.
So, when your client or prospect or member of your Facebook community does something that you want them to do, you need to reward them. And in Facebook, rewarding people is done through engagement. So, when you see somebody post something about like, “Hey, I’m going to Hawaii this weekend.” Well we know they want attention, right? And so, some people might look and say, “Oh that’s dumb like they’re just trying to get attention,” or you can think, well, my client here, a prospect, is interested in attention and I can give him attention so why don’t I just do that and say “Have a great trip. Check out this attraction that I went to last year when I was in Hawaii.” You know what I mean? And so, you want to encourage positive behavior and positive behavior in a Facebook community is them sharing their own stories, feedback and questions. Does that help?
[01:08:34] Brad: Got it. That helps a ton.
[01:08:35] Ryan: Okay. Cool.
[01:08:36] Brad: And I also want to say something here because I know sometimes when financial advisors here, “Oh, you have to post a video a day,” this is not – don’t think like I’ve got to edit a video with my name tag across the bottom. This is like super raw like you’re picking up your iPhone, live streaming from there and that’s what I think is the power of it is the authenticity is here’s me. I mean, I think you have done it from your car before.
[01:08:55] Ryan: Oh yeah. Absolutely. And I’ve got this little stand. I’ll show this to you so you guys, so everybody can see this. This little stand right here and I’ll just literally set it right here on my desk, hit record and sometimes, like when I very first started, I would take bullet point notes. I don’t even do that anymore because I’d rather it be more relevant. I’d rather it be more real. And the more scripted and dialogue and let me make sure my backdrop is just perfect and put the makeup on and like the less people are going to resonate with it because it starts to sound like a commercial rather than, “Hey, let’s be friends,” and have a conversation here like two buddies would over a beer.
[01:09:28] Brad: Yeah. Okay. So, there’s something else and I try to always, “If I’m a financial advisor listening, what am I thinking?” Here’s something that’s going on through a lot of heads right now.
[01:09:36] Ryan: Sure.
[01:09:37] Brad: “That sounds really good and Ryan is charismatic and I’m sure he entertains them and all of that,” but what happens when that troll pops up on the Facebook group? And I think I know how you address this but I’m just going to let you go with it because I’m sure that’s happened where somebody that’s not actually a great fit for your audience and starts just disrespecting people or not really respecting what you built. How do you address that?
[01:10:00] Ryan: So, I think you’ve got it. Okay. So, I’m going to give you my perspective and then the financial perspective.
[01:10:04] Brad: Perfect.
[01:10:04] Ryan: So, from my perspective with Order of Man I think you need to first and foremost distinguish if this is really a troll or if they just don’t agree with your viewpoint. Because I don’t want to be so quick to pull the trigger and say, “You’re a troll,” versus, “Hey, maybe this guy just sees it differently than I do and maybe we can have an intelligent discussion about this.” And I think there’s value in that. I think there’s too many people like, “Oh you don’t agree with me? Gone.” It’s like, “Wait a second. Like, let’s discuss this. Maybe you’re right like I want to know where you’re coming from and maybe you’re not. Maybe I am and I want you to know where I’m coming from but let’s have an intelligent discussion.” With that distinction made, if somebody genuinely is a troll like we had one last night in the group who said he uses a foul language with me and he’s like, “You’re an idiot, blah, blah, blah, blah,” block, delete, done. Like, my space is not a democracy. My planning practice is not a democracy. Order of Man is not a democracy. My financial situation outside of me and my wife is not a democracy. It’s my space and I’ll decide what I want to do with it.
[01:11:08] Brad: Yeah. So, let’s take that to financial services because I think there’s one thing. If it’s what I would call a prospect group which is, “This is open to the public, apply, it’s a closed group and you can get in. You may not be my client,” and I do love how you set the ground rules with the video that you pinned because you kind of say, “Hey, here’s what we’re about, here’s what we’re not about,” and so you set some very clear guidelines. And a lot of that is respecting the other people in the group.
[01:11:32] Ryan: Of course.
[01:11:33] Brad: So, you’ve got that. To me, if I’m a financial advisor, somebody starts just being a moron in there and disrespecting everybody, not a big deal just to boot them out. Let’s say, however, now we’ve got a client group, a private Facebook group that’s just my clients. Now we get into a situation where it’s like, “Oh well, maybe somebody is not being very kind,” but how do you just – does that mean you fire the client and move on? I guess, I’d love to hear your feedback there because I don’t know how I’d address that.
[01:12:00] Ryan: Yeah. That’s a good point and it’s definitely difficult especially if they had millions of dollars invested with you. Because sometimes we tolerate behavior that we wouldn’t normally tolerate because we have a vested interest in tolerating that behavior. And is that something that we should do? You had to question yourself and decide where that line is. There are some things that I wouldn’t tolerate for any amount of money but what are those things? Everybody has to decide for themselves. What I would do for me is I would be very, very clear upfront. Here’s what we do, here’s what we don’t do. If you’re disrespectful to anybody in the group, we don’t tolerate that. We will block you from the group. You and I can still have a relationship if that’s the case but we will not tolerate this behavior. And if you set that expectation upfront and you’re very clear about it and you also shared the ramifications of breaking those boundaries that you’ve created, I find it difficult that anybody reasonable person that you would decide to engage with in a client relationship would have a hard time understanding.
And that’s the thing, like these are your clients. I don’t think that you should bring on a client that you don’t get along with or you don’t like. And I know there’s advisors listening to this right now who have. But why would you want to do that? I don’t understand. I’ve had people that I flat-out said to them, “I’m sorry. We can’t work together,” and they’ve been upset about that. Well, like, “Why? So-and-so works with you. Why can’t we work together?” “I don’t think we’re a great fit. I think your personality and my personality just don’t work together. I think your belief is so far from my belief about how money works that this would not be enjoyable engagement for either one of us so I choose at this point not to have this relationship.” It’s like what if you said like how powerful of a position to be in. And then it’s the same thing. If I had a client inside of a group who started displaying behavior that we didn’t approve of and that were in the boundaries, I would call that client up on the phone.
[01:13:49] Ryan: “Hey, Brad, look, you made some comments in the group today that were a little concerning to me because we have this agreement that this is how we behave and yet here you are attacking this individual. I really like our relationship and I want to continue to work with you but in order to do that, you need to respect me and you need to respect my other clients. This is how we make this community a thriving community like it is. Can we have that agreement?” “Oh yeah, Ryan. I’m sorry. You know, I was having a bad day. My wife and I got an argument and I made a comment.” “Cool. Would you mind going in there and just maybe deleting that or reframing that comment?” Like that’s what clients want from you. They want a leader and yet here we are. We’re like, “Brad said something I don’t like. Like what if I offend him?” What if? What if you don’t say anything and you’re a spineless coward and you let your clients railroad you because they happen to invest a couple of bucks with you. That’s not what they’re looking for and they’re going to leave you with the first opportunity they get anyways.
[01:14:42] Brad: I was wondering when the real Ryan was going to come out. It finally happened, man. Now that’s what I love about you.
[01:14:48] Ryan: I had to get warmed up, right?
[01:14:49] Brad: That’s what I love about you, man. You’re real. Okay. So, here’s what I heard you say just to summarize that. Number one, if you set the rules and guidelines upfront and are very clear about it, a lot of it is self-policing. However, if you get someone that kind of breaks the rules and guidelines, if they were your client, call them up personally and say, “Dude, I love you as a client. We’ve got a community here. We’re trying to all get this common goal of amazing retirement and this comment was a little out of line. Can you go in and delete or self-correct it and then move on? And then second or third offense I got to remove you,” and that would be done with a personal phone call as well?
[01:15:26] Ryan: Yes. Like I said before, I can’t imagine myself, and I can’t speak for everybody, I can’t imagine engaging with the relationship upfront like actually signing contracts in an advisory type capacity with somebody who would make a comment over and over again, that would force me to remove them from a group. Like, I would already know that this person’s probably an asshole before I invited him in the group and they’d show themselves to be that way. Like there’s red flags that you wouldn’t recognize and so be careful. Don’t overlook those red flags because you see the dollar signs.
[01:16:01] Brad: I think what’s interesting is social media creates this veil. And in Facebook, it’s your real profile typically so people know who you are but I think there’s this veil when you’re looking at a screen that you’re not actually what you’re typing. Like, people don’t conduct Facebook conversations like they would at face-to-face conversation and that’s what’s crazy to me. But the more I think about it, if you kind of set up the room, I view it as you’ve kind of set up a permanent client social event where you have allowed them to interact virtually in a room, I think 99.9% of clients are going to respect that and…
[01:16:32] Ryan: Absolutely.
[01:16:33] Brad: And thrive because of it. It’s actually going to deepen the relationship.
[01:16:37] Ryan: And as the leader of the community, what I have to do in my group occasionally is going there and say, “Hey, guys, quick reminder. Here are some ground rules like we do this, this, this and this. We have respect for each other. I’m going to block you, I’m going to delete you if you can’t have respect for one another or you come with these off-the-wall comments that don’t have any basis in reality and they’re offensive to everybody just for the sake of being offensive. Those are just grounds for removal.” And when I post stuff like that, it’s really fascinating. I mean, the engagement on those posts is significantly higher than other posts. And what that tells me is that the people in the community want somebody who’s leading and showing how this group is to be run. And so, if you’re a jerk, the people in your group are going to be jerks. If you’re civil and you can have conversations that maybe you don’t even agree with but you can have a respectful conversation and you can do it, other people will applaud you and follow that behavior.
[01:17:29] Brad: How often do you find yourself having to remind here’s the guidelines? You just post when you think it needs to be done or do you consistently have it…
[01:17:36] Ryan: No. I do it when I notice a trend of behavior that I don’t think is conducive to the type of environment we’re trying to create. If one person does it, it’s an isolated event. I reach out to them, “Hey, guy, like come on. Let’s have some respect for each other.” Really simple. That’s one thing I have an advantage of with being a men’s group. We can do that like guys like we can check each other because that’s what guys do. But if I notice a trend going and going and going or if I noticed a couple of instigators, there’s always a couple of instigators, delete, block, you’re out of here. You’re instigating this and you’re creating this environment that I’m not interested in having.
[01:18:10] Brad: Cool. One last final question on that. So, in the financial advisor space let’s say it’s that private group that is of clients only, someone moves assets or are you now saying that’s one of the ground rules to be in this group, you have to be a member of our financial services firm so we’ll move you back to the public group. How would you handle that?
[01:18:28] Ryan: I would do that because at that point this in your closed group for your clients is an additional offering for them working with you. It’s part of your services that you’re offering and so maybe you include a daily Facebook Live. Maybe you include a market analyses every week. You include some specific details in there that isn’t privy to the public and because you’re giving that to your client, somebody who’s not engaged with you in a client advisory relationship no longer gets access. In a way, it almost be like saying, “Hey, I’m not going to pay my advisory fees but will you still manage my money?” No. “Well, I’m not going to pay your advisory fees but can you still advise me in your Facebook group?” No. I would just consider it part of your offering.
[01:19:15] Brad: I think we just accidentally may have uncovered something that every financial advisor should be doing if you look out the next 10, 20, 30 years because I don’t – do you know of any financial advisor that has a private Facebook group?
[01:19:27] Ryan: No. I don’t know of any.
[01:19:29] Brad: Well, it all started here. When we look back on this podcast we know who came up with it, Ryan.
[01:19:34] Ryan: Yes. And if somebody does it like I’d love to hear that because I think it could be – and I’ve told my friends. I’ve got a couple of advisors that I’m really close with, colleagues that we actually got into the business at the same time. And just because I’m so involved with this other side of things, I don’t do much in the financial planning practice anymore just to be fair and put that out there. And I tell these guys like, “Do this. Look, if you use this, nobody’s doing this as a financial advisor. Do this,” and they’re like, “I don’t know.” They keep doing the same thing and I’m like, “Yeah. Fine. You’re missing the boat.” And I put so much information out there and very few people take advantage of it. Like if somebody did the same things that I’m doing with Order of Man in their financial planning practice, and I’ve had people tell me like, “Well you do it.” “I’m not interested in doing it. I’m giving it to you. Go out. Make it work.” Yeah. Very few people adopt that advice.
[01:20:19] Brad: I kind of stumbled accidentally into this podcasting thing and going on about 18 months now and it’s completely – I mean, my circle now, Cameron Herold, your network is your net worth. I’ll never forget that comment. I feel like my network has expanded exponentially in the last 18 months just due to podcasting.
[01:20:37] Ryan: Absolutely.
[01:20:38] Brad: We wouldn’t be having this conversation.
[01:20:39] Ryan: No way.
[01:20:41] Brad: We wouldn’t have been introduced and obviously we wouldn’t be having my podcast if I didn’t have one.
[01:20:44] Ryan: Absolutely.
[01:20:46] Brad: Cool, man. Are we good to end on a couple of philosophical questions, Ryan?
[01:20:49] Ryan: I’m ready, man. Yeah. I’ve got a little time so I’m ready. How are we going to do this? I’ll try to be the real Ryan for you.
[01:20:55] Brad: Okay. Cool. Okay. So, I’m going to ask my one that I want to – this is I’ve only asked this once, maybe twice but I have to ask you this question because this is a Ryan Michler type of question.
[01:21:05] Ryan: Okay.
[01:21:06] Brad: What is something that you would like to see as absurd 25 years from now?
[01:21:12] Ryan: Like be obsolete? Is that what you’re asking?
[01:21:14] Brad: Kind of like smoking cigarettes is now like, “Wow, people didn’t realize that that caused cancer back in the 50s and 60s,” like the idea of this is absurd.
[01:21:23] Ryan: Right. I would probably say in the financial advisor specifically I would say that these pay type lunches where people pay for their plate of dinner and you give them free advice. I think that’s absurd now let alone in the next 25 to 30 years.
[01:21:41] Brad: Why is that for you? And the reason I asked you that is because there’s a lot of people listening to this. They probably market that way.
[01:21:47] Ryan: Absolutely. Because I’m not going to bribe somebody to do business with me. Like I’m going to put good information out there and I’m going to do it in a meaningful way and I’m going to provide value and I’m going to be awesome and you’re either going to like it or you’re not. And if you don’t, hit the road and if you do, let’s do this but I’m not going to bribe you with a $25 dinner to come to dinner with me or business with me. That’s not the client I’m looking for.
[01:22:11] Brad: Got it. So, here’s what I’m thinking as I hear you, as I kind of think through that. It’s not necessarily I’m not going to do live events because I’m just going to do live events Tony Robbins style where I put out this information that attracts people where they might even buy a ticket to come see me speak and then if they want to become a client from there, cool.
[01:22:32] Ryan: Yeah. Absolutely. But that requires you to be valuable. See, anybody can pay for like I can pay a couple of grand and have people have dinner like that’s easy because it’s just a couple of grand. You get that money back. What I can’t pay for is I can’t pay for the value that I articulate and give to other people. And so, it requires a lot more effort to do that and consistency and it’s much more valuable. You’re going to have many more clients that way and you’re going to be engaged in the type of relationships that are actually valuable and uplifting even to you rather than, “Oh, I just came because I wanted some steak.” That sounds crazy to me.
[01:23:10] Brad: You made me think of a quote I just heard yesterday. It’s, “If you won $1 million, now it’s time to learn how to become a millionaire.” It’s a Jim Rohn quote and I think as a financial advisor just becoming a financial advisor does not necessarily mean you’re a financial advisor. It’s time to go become one now and create that value that attracts – oh that’s what you did with dentists, right?
[01:23:32] Ryan: Absolutely.
[01:23:32] Brad: Like you knew absolutely nothing about the dentistry field I would assume until you started targeting that market and really digging in and becoming an expert in what they needed.
[01:23:41] Ryan: Right. The other thing I would do away with and again specifically in the financial services is commission-based type selling especially when it comes to mutual funds and those sorts of things. There’s this huge conflict of interest that I think is does not put you on the same side of the table as a client.
[01:23:58] Brad: Well, the DOLs helping in that front for sure.
[01:24:00] Ryan: That’s true. That is true.
[01:24:01] Brad: So, let’s go nonfinancial advisory. Let’s do life in general. What would Ryan Michler like to see as absurd 25 years from now?
[01:24:10] Ryan: This one’s kind of funny, bulletproof coffee. And I know that sounds funny but let me tell you why. And this will apply to everything. It’s gaming the system. Like, stop gaming the system. You know how to get in shape and for you to say bulletproof coffee is healthy is ridiculous. If you want to drink coffee, just drink coffee. You don’t need to doll it up and tell everybody it’s healthy by putting butter and MCT oil in it. But we do this and so this is what makes it absurd. It’s common sense like you know how to save money. You know how to lose weight. You know how to connect with your wife or your husband. You know that stuff and yet here we are trying to game the system with bulletproof coffee and tell everybody how healthy we are when in all reality we probably just ought to stop drinking the soda and the chocolate cake. That makes sense?
[01:24:59] Brad: That’s perfect, man.
[01:25:00] Ryan: Geez, man. I love that one. I got to have my bulletproof coffee. Do you do bulletproof coffee?
[01:25:06] Brad: I’ve had it before. Yeah.
[01:25:07] Ryan: Okay. I’m like, maybe I ought to check and see.
[01:25:10] Brad: You know what I think it is? Here’s what I think it is with marketing too. It’s not just gaming the system. It’s here’s this unheard-of thing, this underground thing that you don’t know about and everybody wants to know about it now. So, I think that’s the other thing that drove bulletproof coffee.
[01:25:27] Ryan: For sure. Like we don’t need – you just need to be valuable, not pretend to be valuable. Be valuable.
[01:25:33] Brad: Yeah. All right. When you hear the word successful, who’s the first person you think of and why?
[01:25:39] Ryan: Man, these are good questions. I’m going to go with me on that one. Like honestly, I know that sounds really weird and maybe even arrogant but I’ve come to the stage in my life of complete autonomy and that to me is powerful. Because I don’t know. I mean a lot of guys might say like Mark Cuban or Elon Musk or somebody like that who definitely fall in that scale but I don’t know. I don’t know how much autonomy they have in their life. Like, are they beholden or are they slaves to their work? Are they slaves to what it is they’re doing? Are they slaves to their clients? Like I think anybody who’s genuinely successful has autonomy which means they can do whatever they want, when they want, how they want to do it because that’s what they want to do and they have that freedom to be able to do that. So, it’s hard for me to define and say, “Well, Brad, you’re successful.” I don’t know if you are like only you can define that. Elon Musk, he’s successful. Maybe he is, maybe he isn’t. I don’t know. He defines that. Not me. And so, I think each and every one of us define what success is for ourselves.
[01:26:36] Brad: That is a very stoic answer, my friend. I like that.
[01:26:39] Ryan: Well, you know, every once in a while, I can pull one out of there.
[01:26:42] Brad: At the event in Austin you said something that I loved as a dad so I’m just going to throw it out there. You said you wanted to render yourself obsolete as a dad.
[01:26:50] Ryan: Yeah.
[01:26:51] Brad: Which goes back to your kids and making sure that that same principle’s instilled in them as well. Is there anything as a dad you want to throw out that’s helped on that front?
[01:26:59] Ryan: To be able to render my obsolete? Yeah. The best thing that you can do for your kids is to get out of their way like so many times we as parents want to lead which is good and valuable. There’s times where you need to and you need to be out front. You need to be example. You need to show that stuff. But at the end of the day like I think we give our kids less credit than they deserve. And what I think we should do at some point in our life and multiple times throughout our engagement with our children is to follow them and allow them to lead. I’ll give you a small example. When my son and I, my oldest son and I go on a hike, I let him lead, “Son, take the lead. Where are we going?” And he’ll come to a fork in the road, “Dad, which way should I go?” I’m like, “I don’t know, dude. You’re leading. I’m following you. I can’t decide.” And he’s like, “All right. Let’s go left.” Then we go left and it’s end up being a dud or a dead end or something. He’s like, “Oh man, I made a bad decision.” I’m like, “No, you didn’t. Like that wasn’t a bad decision. Now we know this is a dead end. What are we going to do?” “Let’s turn around and go the other way.” “Cool. Let’s do that. I’ll follow you.” And if we can find examples of that and stop doing every dang thing for our children and letting them flounder and flail and flap around a little bit in a controlled environment, that gives them the ability to do that when it actually matters. So, I think just get out of your kids’ way sometimes.
[01:28:09] Brad: It’s good advice.
[01:28:10] Ryan: Hopefully. We’ll see how it pans out.
[01:28:12] Brad: Yeah. You’ll know in a few years.
[01:28:14] Ryan: That’s right. My oldest is nine so we’ll see.
[01:28:17] Brad: All right. What’s the favorite book you’ve ever read and why?
[01:28:21] Ryan: As A Man Thinketh. Hands down, man, that book is so incredible and it seems like maybe eight or nine years ago there was the big thing, The Secret, right? Like think it and it will be and so I think it got a lot of good press but it also got a lot to bad rap for, “Oh that’s not all there is to it,” and I think inherently we know that’s not all there is to it. Is just the first step. And what I found is the more that I can get my mind right and the more that I can start thinking positively and thinking intelligent thoughts and really debating and pondering the information I come across, that is what manifests itself physically whether it’s a financial planning practice or Order of Man or the way that I approach my duties and responsibilities as a father or a husband, As A Man Thinketh, one of the greatest books written of all time.
[01:29:07] Brad: Very cool. Well, I have to throw this one out because I’m reading it now and it made me think of this podcast today. I’m like this is a Ryan Michler book. This is like an Order of Man type of book.
[01:29:16] Ryan: I’m interested.
[01:29:17] Brad: These guys have full-grown beards. Have you read the book, Endurance: Shackleton’s Incredible Voyage?
[01:29:22] Ryan: I have. I’ve got it right. I don’t know if you can see this. I’ve got some of my books. Endurance is on towards the end of the screen. That is a great book. I actually read that book right before I did the Agoge 60 which is a 60-hour endurance event that Spartan Race puts on and that is such an awesome book.
[01:29:34] Brad: Was that purposefully read like I can do this if these guys did that?
[01:29:38] Ryan: I drew on that book and some of those experience. Are you in the middle of it right now?
[01:29:42] Brad: I am. They’re just hitting land for the first time.
[01:29:45] Ryan: Okay. Yeah. So, I won’t talk much about it but I drew so much from the experiences and the trials and the challenges they went through. And as I was walking in the middle of the night and literally hallucinating thinking I saw people beside me and almost had conversations with them, I was like, “All right, I’m in pain. I’m hallucinating. This sucks. I’m tired, I’m hungry but this isn’t even a sliver, not even a sliver of what those men went through,” and it strengthened my resolve for sure.
[01:30:12] Brad: Yeah. I’m reading the book. It was written in 1959. I’m like this thing reads like a Hollywood blockbuster. I literally cannot put it down.
[01:30:21] Ryan: I wonder if they have a movie of it.
[01:30:22] Brad: I checked. They have not made a movie. I was like this is like DiCaprio, The Revenant.
[01:30:28] Ryan: Yeah. For sure. There’s another book by Angela Duckworth called Grit and it ties in really nicely with Endurance because Grit is more the scientific resolve, resiliency, grit, toughness, fortitude that these men displayed on their voyage in their expedition.
[01:30:47] Brad: Cool. I’m glad you’ve read it. That’s definitely. I thought of you when I was reading that book. I was like, “Ryan has to read this book if he hasn’t.”
[01:30:52] Ryan: Such a great book.
[01:30:53] Brad: All right. So, I want to respect your time. We’re already over here. I know you’ve got big things going on. You probably have all kinds of people on Facebook like, “Where did Ryan go?”
[01:31:04] Ryan: Where is Ryan? No, they do get on. I mean that’s part of the rendering yourself obsolete thing, right? It’s like if they can’t function without me, I haven’t done a great job as a leader.
[01:31:12] Brad: Yeah. All right. So, let’s end with this question. What is the one piece of advice you can share with the audience here today that’s led to your success?
[01:31:21] Ryan: Do something that sparks your interest. I mean here’s the deal. Here’s what most people do. They’ll listen to the podcast and they’ll hear three or four things and like, “Oh it’s a good idea. I should do that.” Eliminate that, “I should do that,” and start putting a timeline on it. I will do that today. I will have this done by the end of the week like just do it. And what’s the worst that can happen? You do it for a couple of months, it doesn’t pan out or you don’t enjoy it and you just revert back to your old ways and things go back to the way they always were. On the positive side, the upside of that is that you do something you’ve never done before and you get the results you’ve never experienced before, you double down on those efforts and your life is something completely different than what you thought it would be. If you were to ask me if I was going to be doing this, what I’m doing with Order of Man three years ago, I’d be like, “What are you talking?”
I remember the first time I heard about a blog. I was in Iraq and one of our lieutenants was writing I can’t remember – he must have been writing in the computer and I’m like, “Oh, what are you doing?” He’s like, “Writing in my blog.” I’m like, “What’s a blog? I don’t even know what that is.” He’s like, “Oh, you just write about your experiences and share it with people.” I’m like, “That’s stupid. Nobody wants to hear about what you have to say.” Like I wasn’t being insulting to him but I was like nobody cares. And yet here I am 10 years later, blogging, podcasting, doing the exact thing I said was stupid 10 years ago. So, the one thing that people should be doing is the one thing that’s bouncing in their brain right now and they’re excited about doing. And that when they get into the office and they’re trying to put out fires and the client wants to move their money and their kids were yelling at them and their wife got into an argument or wrecked the car or whatever, they forget about what we talked about and they revert into that pattern of old ways and they get the same experience they’ve always experienced in their life.
[01:32:56] Brad: Yeah. Just take action. I’m with you there, man. This started out as an experiment to me too and now I’m like what would I – because I feel like this is – I told one of my former guests I was like, “Literally nobody listens to my podcast whatsoever. I would still do it because what I love is curiosity of having an incredible conversation with somebody I respect and I can learn something from.” So, if my podcast was nothing more than that, it’s still a win for me.
[01:33:18] Ryan: Yeah. I can definitely relate with that. And the other side of podcasting that I really enjoy and that I look out with the work that I’m doing here is that I do honestly believe that it’s a steppingstone to something greater. Like, will I be podcasting in 20 years? Not the way that I am now even if it’s around. It will be something bigger and grander and greater and like we have all these little steps. So, people ask me all the time, “Ryan, what’s the first step to starting a business? What’s the first step to getting in shape?” It’s like the first step is the first step. You already know what it is. Just take that step. You don’t have to solve world hunger or anything right now or global peace like just take the first step and see where it takes you and then you can take the next step after that.
[01:33:58] Brad: Well, man, this has been a very fun conversation.
[01:34:01] Ryan: Cool.
[01:34:01] Brad: First of all, Ryan, I just want to say thank you. I’ve already benefited. We haven’t known each other that long but I’ve benefited from your podcast from the time you spend out at the dad’s retreat out in Austin and the mission you’re on, creating better men. Obviously, there is a huge shortage of that out there so thank you. Everybody could use better dads, better husbands out there so thanks for all the effort and time that you poured into making that happen.
[01:34:27] Ryan: You bet, man. My honor. And thanks for having me on the show. It’s a lot of fun. I enjoyed our conversation for sure so hopefully you and some of the guys got some stuff from it.
[01:34:33] Brad: Cool. And one other thing that I don’t want to glance over. You’re also a veteran, an Iraqi war veteran. Thank you for serving our country. I think too often in our country, people just walk around free pursuing their dreams without really giving credit to the people that help keep it that way so thank you for that as well.
[01:34:50] Ryan: Yeah. My honor. My honor for sure.
[01:34:52] Brad: All right, dude. Let’s wrap with as far as the listeners here, where do you want them – if they want to continue the conversation with you, where should they go to stay in touch with Order of Man or Ryan?
[01:35:01] Ryan: Yes. The best thing is OrderofMan.com. That’s our headquarters so we’ve got all the information over there. If you are a man and you want more of a conversation that we’ve been talking about, I know you’re a member of the group, again that’s Facebook.com/groups/OrderofMan and that’s our closed Facebook group with almost 29,000 or whatever it is, 29,000 guys in there. So, yeah, those are the two resources I’d give you.
[01:35:22] Brad: All right, Ryan. Well, I appreciate the time, man. Have an awesome day.
[01:35:25] Ryan: I appreciate it, brother. You too.
[01:35:26] Brad: Take care.
[01:35:30] Brad: Thanks for checking out this week’s show with Ryan Michler of Order of Man. This week we’re actually going to highlight two recent reviews. The first one comes from Brooke Craven who says, “Awesome podcast. Brad, host of the Elite Advisor Blueprint, highlights all aspects of investing in this can’t miss podcast. The host and expert guest offer insightful advice and information that is helpful to anyone that listens.” I appreciate the kind words, Brooke. Thank you for listening. One of the things I hear constantly in many of the reviews and feedback from our Blueprint listeners is you guys love the guests I have on so I’ll keep doing my best to deliver there. Actually, a little sneak peek, stay tuned for some upcoming shows with one of the top RIAs in the country who manages over a billion dollars of assets. And also, we’ll have one of the foremost wine experts in the world coming up where we dig deep into how to host a proper wine party and talk intelligently about wine especially when it comes to ordering off the menu. That’s always tough. So, I’m excited for these shows.
Our next review comes in from Andy Storch. He says, “Awesome podcast for financial advisors. Awesome podcast with high-quality guests and tons of value. If you’re trying to make it as an independent financial advisor, you need to check out this show,” from Andy Storch, host of the Entrepreneur Hot Seat Podcast. It’s always fun to see who these reviews come in from and Andy is actually a friend I met out at Jon Vroman’s dad’s retreat out in Austin. So, really honored and it means a lot that he’s giving the show a listen. You’re the man, Andy, if you’re listening to this. What’s fun is that Andy actually isn’t a financial advisor. He is a consultant and a coach so it’s really cool for me to see him getting value out of the show as well. He also has his own podcast so for those of you that haven’t checked out his, it’s the Entrepreneur Hot Seat. Make sure you go out there, check it out, review it, give him some love. As a financial advisor, a lot of that will apply to you as well.
[01:37:25] Brad: So, that’s it for this week’s show and for those out there who haven’t given a review yet, I’d love if you take a quick second to do so at BradleyJohnson.com/iTunes. And if you have future guests we need to have on the show, make sure to include them in your comments as we read all of them and love to grab a great idea for a future guest there. That’s it for this week’s show. Thanks for listening and we’ll catch you on the next show. Take care.
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